Fwd: ground wires
Qualudia101@aol.com
Qualudia101@aol.com
Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:22:04 -0600
Guys: here is a reply which I think helps answer our questions. This guy is
from the supplier of Hyper wires. He has me confused with Jon,but anyhow the
response is what is of interest.
Frank 93 SER
> Subj:Re: ground wires
> Date:3/18/2003 10:51:12 AM Pacific Standard Time
> From:<A HREF="mailto:info@sunautomobile.com">info@sunautomobile.com</A>
> To:<A HREF="mailto:Qualudia101@aol.com">Qualudia101@aol.com</A>
> Sent from the Internet
> Frank,
> Thanks for your inquiry about the Hyper Ground System. Like you, I am not
> an engineer nor do I claim to be, but what I have seen is that the Hyper
> Ground has shown some type of gain on every vehicle we have tested it on.
> Many of our customers who have bought Hyper Ground have reported a
> noticeable improvement in performance, and we have not heard of anyone who
> was dissatisfied with our product.
> A lot of what this person says definately holds water, such as routing,
> ground points, crimps etc. playing an important role. Because the Sun Auto
> Hyper Ground kit is constructed of the highest quality materials (99.99%
> pure copper, 1477 strands per wire, available 3-layered shielding and gold
> plated terminals) the addition of our kit placed in the best points with
> effective routing should show a noticeable improvement. Also, the inherent
> ground problem that Nissans' in general seem to have will only amplify the
> effect of having Hyper Ground installed. We tested a 97 Maxima, which
> posted considerable gains. The car was a customers vehicle at XS
> Engineering [(714) 698-8300] and had simple bolt on accessories
> (exhaust/intake), left as is for dyno runs with and without hyperground.
> The reults showed the following:
> without Hyper Ground: 168.6 hp / 178.4 ft/lb tq
> with Hyper Ground: 176.6 hp/ 191.6 ft/lb tq
> In Japan, our Hyper Ground kit (sold as Hot Earth for JDM) showed a 10hp
> gain on an R32 GTR. This type of "earth tuning" emerged in Japan a few
> years ago and is widely accepted there as effective in improving electrical
> efficiency resulting in a power gain. Our kit is offered as OEM factory
> option equipment on the 350Z (JDM),the Lancer EVO 8 (both US market and
> JDM), as well as other Toyota, Subaru, Nissan, Isuzu and Mitsubishi
> vehicles . Now, in order for any equipment to be offered as an option from
> the factory, the amount of testing involved is lengthy and strenuous; as
> well as any power/efficiency gains, stress testing/durability testing etc
> must be passed before parts get approved for sale as OEM equipment. Hence,
> the construction quality of Sun's product should be noted.
> When all is said and done, the only way to truly prove that our product is
> useful and effective to the SE-R community is to actually put in on and
> dyno it. Through dyno testing you can also find the best grounding points
> for your application as well. We have not yet had the chance to directly
> test the Hyper Ground System on an SE-R; unfortunately, although we would
> like to have data on a vast array of makes and models, we are not in a
> position to be able to dyno every car available. Just as you noted, "the
> only way to know is to try and document it." If you come across any one who
> has actually dynoed an SE-R with Hyper Ground we would be very interested
> in seeing the results as well. Additionally, if I come across any more
> information specific to the SE-R regarding Hyper Ground, I will be more
> than happy to forward the info to you. Again, thanks for your inquiry; we
> look forward to hearing from you again soon and gaining the support of the
> SE-R community!
> Regards,
> S.O.T., Inc.
> 3605 W. Macarthur Blvd. Suite 705
> Santa Ana, CA 92704
> Tel: 714-708-7733
> Fax:714-708-7722
> Toll Free: 1-888-SUN-0767
> <A HREF="http://www.sunautomobile.com/">www.sunautomobile.com</A>
Return-Path: <info@sunautomobile.com>
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From: "Info" <info@sunautomobile.com>
To: <Qualudia101@aol.com>
References: <9.cd771e5.2ba815bb@aol.com>
Subject: Re: ground wires
Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 22:48:56 -0800
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Frank,
Thanks for your inquiry about the Hyper Ground System. Like you, I am not an
engineer nor do I claim to be, but what I have seen is that the Hyper Ground
has shown some type of gain on every vehicle we have tested it on. Many of our
customers who have bought Hyper Ground have reported a noticeable improvement
in performance, and we have not heard of anyone who was dissatisfied with our
product.
A lot of what this person says definately holds water, such as routing, ground
points, crimps etc. playing an important role. Because the Sun Auto Hyper
Ground kit is constructed of the highest quality materials (99.99% pure
copper, 1477 strands per wire, available 3-layered shielding and gold plated
terminals) the addition of our kit placed in the best points with effective
routing should show a noticeable improvement. Also, the inherent ground
problem that Nissans' in general seem to have will only amplify the effect of
having Hyper Ground installed. We tested a 97 Maxima, which posted
considerable gains. The car was a customers vehicle at XS Engineering [(714)
698-8300] and had simple bolt on accesories (exhaust/intake), left as is for
dyno runs with and without hyperground. The reults showed the following:
without Hyper Ground: 168.6 hp / 178.4 ft/lb tq
with Hyper Ground: 176.6 hp/ 191.6 ft/lb tq
In Japan, our Hyper Ground kit (sold as Hot Earth for JDM) showed a 10hp gain
on an R32 GTR. This type of "earth tuning" emerged in Japan a few years ago
and is widely accepted there as effective in improving electrical efficiency
resulting in a power gain. Our kit is offered as OEM factory option equipment
on the 350Z (JDM),the Lancer EVO 8 (both US market and JDM), as well as other
Toyota, Subaru, Nissan, Isuzu and Mitsubishi vehicles . Now, in order for any
equipment to be offered as an option from the factory, the amount of testing
involved is lengthy and strenuous; as well as any power/efficiency gains,
stress testing/durability testing etc must be passed before parts get approved
for sale as OEM equipment. Hence, the construction quality of Sun's product
should be noted.
When all is said and done, the only way to truly prove that our product is
useful and effective to the SE-R community is to actually put in on and dyno
it. Through dyno testing you can also find the best grounding points for your
application as well. We have not yet had the chance to directly test the Hyper
Ground System on an SE-R; unfortunately, although we would like to have data
on a vast array of makes and models, we are not in a position to be able to
dyno every car available. Just as you noted, "the only way to know is to try
and document it." If you come across any one who has actually dynoed an SE-R
with Hyper Ground we would be very interested in seeing the results as well.
Additionally, if I come across any more information specific to the SE-R
regarding Hyper Ground, I will be more than happy to forward the info to you.
Again, thanks for your inquiry; we look forward to hearing from you again soon
and gaining the support of the SE-R community!
Regards,
S.O.T., Inc.
3605 W. Macarthur Blvd. Suite 705
Santa Ana, CA 92704
Tel: 714-708-7733
Fax:714-708-7722
Toll Free: 1-888-SUN-0767
www.sunautomobile.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Qualudia101@aol.com
To: info@sunautomobile.com
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 10:24 PM
Subject: Re: ground wires
Thank you for your reply. I am debating with a fellow SE-R owner and the
following is his response to me. I wonder if you would care to reply on his
comments.
Frank Las Vegas.
From SE-R owner:
These sound like snake oil to me. The ECU in our cars has a separate ground
plane for signals vs. power and switching. The only thing you could do to
improve noise is careful wire routing, check crimps and ground points and
if
you wanted to go to the nth degree, you could use some ultra shielded wire
for the signals. I doubt that would even make a SOTP difference, the
electrical system is well designed to hedge against interference. That
being
said, if the Sun ground wires aren't routed well, it could very well
increase noise. The only thing I see them doing is providing a few extra
millivolts to the starter while cranking. It might even help with a few
millivolts while the alternator is putting out a lot of current, but again
that wouldn't affect the ECU significantly unless you were switching a 50
amp load at 400 Hz.
Jon Davis
Reply from another SER owner to Joe Davis comments above:-
On Sun, Mar 16, 2003 at 08:50:32PM -0500, Jon Davis wrote:
> These sound like snake oil to me. The ECU in our cars has a separate
ground
> plane for signals vs. power and switching. The only thing you could do to
> improve noise is careful wire routing, check crimps and ground points and
if
It's not *just* about noise, and it does involve rerouting. Remember
that SE-Rs seem to have an inherent problem with bad grounds... Anybody
heard of a MAF Sensor Reground Proceedure?
> you wanted to go to the nth degree, you could use some ultra shielded
wire
> for the signals. I doubt that would even make a SOTP difference, the
I'd be inclined to agree if I hadn't seen dyno charts indicating a 3+
WHP gain, which is noticable (timing advance, WAI, cat-back, all in the
same power gain class).
> increase noise. The only thing I see them doing is providing a few extra
> millivolts to the starter while cranking. It might even help with a few
Look, I'm not an engineer, and I never claimed to be. The only way to
know is to try it and document it. Who's game?
In a message dated 3/17/2003 8:49:19 AM Pacific Standard Time,
info@sunautomobile.com writes:
Subj:Re: ground wires
Date:3/17/2003 8:49:19 AM Pacific Standard Time
From:info@sunautomobile.com
To:Qualudia101@aol.com
Sent from the Internet
Thank you for your interest in our Hyper Ground System. You are looking
for
the Universal S-Type which will be compatible with your SE-R 2.0 Liter
Engine 1993.
S-Type Red, Blue, Yellow..................................$98.50 per set
S-Type Gold, Silver............................................$118.50
per
set
For more product information or to place an order, please contact us toll
free at 888/786-0767. Enjoy the day!
Sun Auto U.S.A., Inc.
3605 W. Macarthur Blvd.
Suite 705
Santa Ana, CA 92604
Tel: 714/708-7733
Fax: 714/708-7722
----- Original Message -----
From: <Qualudia101@aol.com>
To: <info@sunautomobile.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 7:14 AM
Subject: ground wires